Makara IC

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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:26 pm

Zarethria gives Parveth's indignation a rather affronted look, as if she's disappointed with Parveth's lack of decorum, and replies "I realize this is all rather sudden and unexpected. I was hoping I could persuade her to make an exception for you four in this circumstance, but she was having none of that. I am sorry if you're upset, but I don't imagine a day to think on it would result in anything different than whatever time you'd take to discuss things among yourselves and it would give her the opinion that you're reluctant where if you are going to do so, it would benefit us for you to appear enthusiastic or at least open to the idea. As for your lack of religious knowledge, I'm sure she would be more than happy to send over some acolytes to tell you whatever you'd wish to know."
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Dr Blight on Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:06 am

Adelinde frowns a little at the turn of events, stroking Elizabeth's head on her shoulder as she hums in thought for a moment. "Well, to begin with, is this room the only option available? If so, do we ALL have to be present for this meeting or could we perhaps send just one or so as a representative? I certainly won't be making any decisions to that nature before speaking with this acolyte and learning more about Lolth, but I at least don't have any immediate reasons to refuse either."

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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:11 am

"She's rather insisting on the room and it would look suspicious to refuse when I was the one claiming it's an important matter. It's also safer for us if any agreements are made there as well." Zarethria replies.
"No, you don't all need to be present. Though the more of you the better, especially Parveth. Best would be all of you, both so that you all can speak and because it would look best for her to be able to claim she converted you all. I'm glad you're keeping an open mind."
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Dr Blight on Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:35 am

"Yes I can see that she's far more interested in one of us in particular... Still we're not here specifically to raise her status. So while I'd encourage my friends to hear the acolyte out and decide for themselves. If Parveth still refuses she'll just have to be happy with what she gets in that regard. As you said this isn't a choice to be taken lightly."

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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:57 am

While the group discusses, Nendriia calls back and points to Ketha, "Make sure they leave that thing they are carrying outside of my temple."
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:34 pm

Steam thinks for a moment, mumbling to herself, "Pretty sure this doesn't break contract," before making a sort of big nod and stating with a grin, "I'd be good with starting a long life of praising the...how'd you address her? Spider Queen of Lies?"

Parveth continues to be nonplussed, but makes something of an effort to compose her presence.
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Paper Shadow on Sun Jun 24, 2018 8:53 pm

Ketha's reply is blunt as usual. "This request is rude. I am uninterested, but I will hear out the acolyte."
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Sun Jun 24, 2018 9:06 pm

"Just a moment, I'll call over someone to answer your questions." Zarethria says in reply to pretty much everyone, clearly not interested in giving religious lectures herself.
Having said that, she waves over what is clearly an acolyte. A young female drow in simple black robes. The acolyte walks over and asks, "You would like to learn about Lolth? Come with me then so we're not standing in the way of others." Having said such, she leads the group a few dozen feet away to one side so they're not standing between the doors and people coming into the temple. She walks a little ways up the steps and then sits down and motions for those who followed her to sit. Then she says, "I am Xin. So what would you like to know?"
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Paper Shadow on Sun Jun 24, 2018 9:42 pm

Ketha follows the acolyte, and kneels casually, a foot on a step higher than the other, with an arm casually resting on that leg's knee. "What would worshipping Lolth entail?" Ketha asks, "What is expected from a worshipper of Lolth?"
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Sun Jun 24, 2018 9:50 pm

Xin smiles and clasps her hands, "An excellent place to start! Well about the same as would be expected as a regular worshiper of any of the other gods I expect. Following Lolth's tenants as much as you're able in your day to day life, though unless you are a priestess you wouldn't be expected to go to any extremes. Praying for forgiveness in earnest when you are not. Praying for guidance for those things that fall under her preview when you wish her blessing. A prayer of thanks whenever you feel she had given you her blessing in some way or perhaps a daily prayer at some time you feel is suitable."
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:03 pm

Steam does a slav-squat loafs on the steps. She raises a hand, and then without waiting for Xin to address her she says, "What's an example of some of her tenants? And what sort of signs might we look out for to see her pleasure and or annoyance with our actions?"
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:23 pm

Xin replies, "Her tenants are: 'Do whatever it takes to gain and hold power.' 'Rely on stealth and slander in preference to outright confrontation.' and 'Seek to convert other fey creatures to Lolth's faith and the death of those who will not.' I'm sure those all sound a bit extreme, but there's a lot of nuance to these tenets and of course like all divine tenants, these are what were passed down from ages beyond counting when the world was a less civilized place.
The first tenant... well "do whatever" there doesn't mean you have to go beyond what you feel comfortable with. Not everyone can be at the top for sure, because then nobody would farm or fish or weave. But its Lolth wish that we each and as a whole as a faith try to have as much power over our situation as we can.
The second, well I'm sure it might sound odd to you. To encourage lies and sneakiness. But Lolth isn't a goddess or war. In her way, she's a goddess of peace. Confrontation is inevitable, but combating with subtle means results in a lot less needless death and destruction.
The third, well I imagine the second part of that sounds pretty bad. I'm sure in the old times drow would indeed have killed those who refused to convert. Though I'm just as sure the faithful of many other gods would have done the same. Like I said before, the world in the old times was a lot more savage. Now it really just means that she would wish us to fight those would would try and demand we not worship her or stop us trying to convert others to her faith. The first part of the third tenant is pretty self-evident I think, but I'll still explain a bit anyway. Lolth wishes to be seen as goddess of all fey, as is her rightful place, and wishes we do what we can to make that happen."


She pauses for a moment to let that soak in, then continues. "She also adores spiders and as such we should see them as holy creatures not to be harmed if it can be avoided and to be treated with respect and affection. As for signs. Well if Lolth is pleased with you you might find there are shadows to hide in when you most need them or a good lie springs to mind or you come across opportunities for improve your situation or you come across a spider. If she is displeased with you, you might find your enemies escape you or nobody believes you clever words or even that they fail to come to mind when you need them. Or you get attacked by wild spiders I suppose." She finishes that last part with an amused smile as if to say "even a goddess of subtle things can be blunt and direct at times".
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:33 pm

As Xin lists the tenants, Steam counts on her fingers and follows along under her breath, "Check. Very check. Eh, we'll cross that bridge when it spiders." She mulls for a moment after Xin finishes, nodding slightly to herself before stating, "Neat!"
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Dr Blight on Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:02 am

Adelinde can't help but chuckle slightly at the part about being attacked by wild spiders. "Is there anything we'd need to watch out for? As in for example a god that doesn't get along with Lolth and might take it out on us? "

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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:25 pm

Xin holds her hand to the side of her face and gives Adelinde a quizzical expression and thinks about this for a while before saying, "Unless you do something to specifically anger a deity, I don't imagine so. But I'm not sure any mortal can speak to what they will or won't respond to. Sometimes in the tales I have heard gods often pay no mind to mortals for the most part aside from great deeds and in others they take offense at incredibly minor things. I guess the safest way would be to always give a short prayer to any god whose domain you are about to or have just interacted with but, I can't imagine anyone actually doing that." She then gives a shrug.

"But I will tell you about the general relationship Lolth has with other gods since that's kind of what you asked." she continues, though it sounds a bit more like a question than a statement.
"Corellon and Sehanine also claim dominion over the Fey and they might be annoyed if you solely worship Lolth, especially if you abandoned their faith for hers. Though as our society has thrived just fine while some even occasionally spit on their names, I don't think it's likely you'll attract their ire by simply not worshiping them.
I can't speak as to Bahamut himself, but from what I know, which is very little I feel like I should point out, his followers often view lies and deception as the opposite of honor. So I guess.... just lie to them if it comes up?"
She pauses to give a little chuckle here.
"Melora I have heard is upset with any deity that has claimed any aspect of nature, but Lolth's dominion over one kind of natural creature likely pales in comparison of other deities claiming seasons and such.
Zehir probably finds the technical differences between Shadows and Darkness not worth considering."
she shrugs here again, "But again, we've lived down in the Underdark here for ages and honored Lolth and not him and we're still fine so I don't think you're at any major risk..... Or well..." she looks at Ketha here, "You wouldn't be if you weren't carrying that artifact around with you. He might pay a bit more attention to what happens around it. If you aren't going to give it to someone else, I would suggest doing a daily prayer to him so that he knows you're not slighting him by thanking Lolth when you find comfort and safety in the dark places."
She then adds, "You know you can't bring that in the temple right?"
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:01 pm

Parveth staunchly stays where she is when the rest of the group move over to learn more about Lolth. She’s kind of over this whole experience, and wants to be done with the drow and their apparent penchant for surprises. She briefly considers that if {DROW CITY 1} does move to the surface, she won’t be able to avoid them entirely, but that’s a problem she’ll have to live with.

Steam nods along as Xin talks, “I’m pretty well sold already, but if you could satisfy my curiosity, what sort of deeds Lolth has done in the past? Like, how’d you get sectioned down here?”
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Sun Jul 01, 2018 3:22 pm

"Well that's a long story. I can try to give the short version. But... is your friend going to stay over there the whole time?" Xin asks, sounding a bit sad and anxious.
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:19 pm

Steam also turns to look at Parveth. The wood elf’s eyes are no kinder to her. “Yeah, probably. She’s kind of a grump, and like you just said Lolth and Sehanine don’t really roll together.” She gives a friendly wave, beckoning Parveth over.

((Parveth makes a charisma save versus be rude: (16) = (14) +2 ))
The wood elf’s visible demeanor changes from visibly disgruntled to just sort of blank, and she moves over to join the powwow. “I suppose I should at least hear you out.”
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Sun Jul 01, 2018 6:38 pm

Xin looks to Parveth with a smile and says, "Your genasi friend just asked me about the deeds of Lolth and how the drow ended up here. I'm glad you've come to join us. I'll be starting with the tale of how elves came to be. I do wonder if it will be much different from the one your people tell."
She then pauses before settling in. "After the Gods were born from the Elemental Chaos and made themselves different from the Primordials and made creation, but before the War for Creation against the Primordials, there was the god Corellon. Like many of the older gods he was very much a being of choatic nature. He went and did what he pleased, changing shape at will, making and breaking vows without a care, making the realm of Arvandor. This angered Gruumsh and eventually they had a confrontation. Of Corellon's blood was born the first elves, which were more like him than what we are today. They too took on new forms at a whim. When he finally notices their existence he was pleased with them. He raised up several into proper godhood, though most would later perish in the War for Creation. Lolth was the first of those he raised, Sehanine the third. For a time the elves lived besides their gods. Lolth saw that other creatures were coming into being in other places of the cosmos and through her suggestion they made the other fey beings. Eventually she came to see that those creatures with intelligence and cunning fared better in the long term than those that were big or strong or quick. And that the elves if they remained as they were would wind up as little more than simply one of any of the other fey creatures they had made. She knew that in time Corellon would tire of them in the way he eventually tired of anything he did and moved on to something else. So she convinced the elves that if they gave up a small bit of their capricious freedom for a stable form, they could re-mold them into a something that would rise above the other creatures and flourish on their own.
The elves agreed and so it was done. And so the first of the races was born. At first Corellon did not notice. He only took note when he saw that the elves had changed from viewing Corellon as their everything to viewing him as their father, the one who had sired them, and Lolth as their mother, the one who set them on the path to their destiny. Corellon was revolted by this perceived betrayal and railed against Lolth's 'intrusion' upon 'his creation', not that he had ever intended to create the elves. Some of the elves rose to her defense. They argued that no entity who sprang from Corellon, especially one who simply wanted the elves to flourish, should be attacked. Those who remained advocates of Corellon insisted that their sire also wanted greatness for the elves and that such greatness could be achieved if all the elves followed Corellon's lead.
The elves gathered in great hosts around Lolth and Corellon as each entity pleaded its case. When he broke his word, as is Corellon's nature, and attacking Lolth in the middle of her speaking, many of the elves interfered. A battle broke out with Corellon's followers on one side and Lolth's on another and those who followed other deities took sides as fit them or in a few cases like those that followed Sehanine, didn't take sides at all.
The battle was a draw, but this act rent the elves asunder. The elves, though no longer formless, had begun to grow different from one another. In a final act of vindictiveness, Corellon separated Arvandor from the Feywild as a whole and did not permit any elves or elven souls entry into his paradise, but those who have become so much other fey creatures that they have become as the elves were before they took their forms. This rift created the pathways into other places, which is how we elves came to the Natural world. Many of the elves and the elven deities blamed Corellon's ire on Lolth and she and her favored fled their wrath. Which is how we drow came to live in the Underdark."


Parveth:

This is pretty similar to the elven origin story Parveth would have heard. The key difference being that the version she heard painted Lolth as unhappy being Corellon's underling and tricking the elves into the choice to adopt stable forms with false promises and slander of Corellon. That Lolth was the one who attacked Corellon, not the other way around. And that Lolth and her drow tried to kill those that would not worship her as Queen of All Fey, but the others defeated them and drove them down into the Underdark. And generally making Lolth sound worse and Corellon better. Also in your case Sehanine is painted as wiser and more important.
Of course having been outside of the sister cities you're aware that the people where you come from have some pretty heavy biases. Of course the drow probably do too. So it's hard to say whose version is closer to the truth.
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:40 pm

Parveth listens attentively, face remaining fairly neutral as she’s told a story she pretty well anticipated. After Xin finishes her tale, she pauses for a couple of moments in contemplation before saying, “A similar tale to what I have been told. Three brothers tell three tales*, I suppose. Now does not seem the appropriate time, but if you would care to hear another brother’s tale I would be willing to share it.”

*imagine an elvish phrase referring to people seeing different things by mere virtue of being different people, and it’s cool and not just awkward. Whether this phrase was created after the split or not I’ll leave up to rams, though if they speak modern Elvish I guess they’d understand it?
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:47 pm

Xin gives an understanding smile, indicating she gets what Parveth means. Then her smile turns to an amused one as she says, "We're all sisters here though, cousin." Then smile becomes a grin indicating she's just amused by the wordplay. Then she says, "By all means." and gives a go ahead gesture with her right hand.
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:03 pm

Parveth thinks for a moment. “I would not tell a tale bemoaning the master in their own home. If you insist though...” She pauses for affirmation from Xin, continuing only if prompted.
“The gist of the differences is that Lolth’s prominence in deception is much more apparent, and the cleverness in her lies has been less appreciated by those who were misled.”
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Re: Makara IC

Post  Ramsus on Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:09 pm

Xin gave the nod. After Parveth speaks she has a grin and replies, "Mislead hmm? So are you saying you do not believe you are the superior kind of fey?" Her words have an almost teasing air, as if she's acknowledging she just asked Parveth a trick question.
The idea here is that while it's a negative stereotype that elves think they're the best of the races and better than most other creatures.... it's also kind of true even for those who aren't like "yeah, that's 100% the case and I'll prove it! Probably by outliving you and mocking your corpse!"

((Info included because Parveth rolled crazy good on a roll follows.))
Now that she's thinking about that and the whole elven origin story, she realizes that Lolth's whole "let's make you better yous" might be the basis for that behavior. Though it still makes it just as much a question, if not an even more valid one, of if elves really are superior beings, to at least some races, in at least some important way.
As has been brought up by all this, she realizes that Lolth is a being of deception..... but Corellon and Sehanine also are too, just in their own ways. So the truth of the tale is probably not what any one side would claim. Assuming any given part or even the whole thing aren't dramatizations or complete fiction.
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:13 am

“Superior to some and lesser to others; it is not my right to reckon the positions of the stars. But, I am distracting you from this huddle’s purpose. If you would care to discuss this further while the others are in talks, I will be available.” And she sort of beckons at the rest of the group to ask another question.
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Re: Makara IC

Post  quietkal on Sun Jul 29, 2018 12:10 am

There's sort of a long pause as the group looks at each other to see who has a question, but after some contemplation Steam asks, "You said Lolth encourages progressing our plans through subtelty. What about bringing the schemes of others to light?"
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